Zen Wisdom for Venture Creation | Kouji Miki
Disclaimer:
The content shared is to highlight the passion and wonder of our guests. It is not professional advice. Please read our evidence-based research to help you develop your unique understanding.
💕 Story Overview
#MAGICademy S3E6, we had the great pleasure of meeting @Kouji Miki, founder of @Zen 2.0 to discover how Zenful meditation helps clear mental clutter to foster deep awareness, creativity, and true innovation by encouraging focused non-judgmental thinking. We'll also dive into how revisiting childhood memories helps uncover our innate passions and talents, guiding us toward a more authentic purpose, or Ikigai.
Story Takeaways
The Zen approach emphasizes complete awareness of one's environment, which allows for both intuitive and analytical insights crucial for idea creation. The non-duality principle of Zen encourages withholding premature judgment, creating a learning space where new ideas can be explored without immediate acceptance or rejection.
In meditation, our minds initially resemble a glass of muddy water, with thoughts and distractions clouding our awareness. As we focus on our breath and remain present, the mental agitation begins to settle, enabling the "mud" of our thoughts to fall away and revealing the clear water of calmness and insight.
Exploring childhood memories has the potential to rediscover our Ikigai by revealing passions, natural talents, and core values that shaped our early experiences. Reflecting on joyful activities and sources of happiness can align our current life with what we love, guiding us toward a more fulfilling and authentic purpose.
Kouji’s MAGIC: Deep dive into people’s minds to find their “hidden treasure”
#Zen, #Innovation, #Mindfulness, #Meditation, #Calmness, #Inclusivity, #ChildlikeWonder, #Curiosity, #Ikigai, #TeamDynamics
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00:00 Introduction and Sense of Calmness
01:12 How to manage a busy mind during meditation?
04:50 Finding Innovation Within Searching Inside Yourself
04:57 Spreading the wisdom of Zen to the world
09:16 How does Zen support the process of innovation?
09:43 The ideas are always inside of us
12:19 Data Driven Innovation and True Innovation
13:54 Zen & Ikigai
15:29 The "Outsider" view gives us strength and inclusive perspectives
21:23 Zen meditation promotes deep team connections
23:25 The magic of childlike wonder on innovation
27:44 Kouji's childlike wonder: deep dive into the ocean
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Seeing your story from the outside gives us resilience: https://youtube.com/shorts/4v2NMG8rwZM
The story of 10 cows-ideas are already inside of us: https://youtube.com/shorts/vODyGDlc_oo
Feel other’s emotions slowly to develop a more inclusive perspective: https://youtube.com/shorts/T6XMCkoMlWU
Managing a busy mind to bring muddy water into a clear state: https://youtu.be/RnKxZV9GcFw
Zen meditation for deep team building: https://youtu.be/GedE013ib8Y
The 10-year-old us knows our Ikigai: https://youtu.be/wK-6LXlJVns
Rediscovering Childhood Excitement (Ikigai) Through Zen:
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Ming, L., & Jang, C. G. (2018, July). The Research of Cultural and Creative Product Design Based on the Zen Buddhism Culture. In 2018 International Seminar on Education Research and Social Science (ISERSS 2018) (pp. 69-72). Atlantis Press.
Castellani, B., & Gerrits, L. (2024). Mindfulness, imagination and creativity. In The Atlas of Social Complexity (pp. 196-206). Edward Elgar Publishing.
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Kouji Miki is a Zen-based coach specializing in mindfulness for executives and CEOs, with a Master's degree in Media and Governance from Keio University. After experiencing personal challenges that led him to Zen meditation, he founded the Zen2.0 conference in 2017, which has become the world's largest international gathering on Zen and mindfulness for over 6 years, attracting mindful speakers and participants globally. Kouji's mission is to integrate traditional Zen philosophies with modern technologies to foster innovation and societal change, and he has authored two books, "Let's Start Micro-Monozukuri" and "True Innovation," focusing on creating innovation through Zen-like dialogue.
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Jiani (00:00)
Welcome to MAGICademy podcast. Today with us is Koji. He is the initiator, organizer of Zen 2 .0, a global conference on mindfulness practices and its integration between business innovation. And so great to have you Koji today with us.
mikikouj (00:17)
Thank you for inviting such a nice opportunity.
Jiani (00:21)
I can just hear birds singing in your background and immediately that gives me a sense of peacefulness and gentleness zenfulness feel like you carry this sense of calmness with you even through the screen I can feel that yes
mikikouj (00:44)
Thank you very much. Because I'm doing Zazen every morning. In the morning, especially, I do the special mantra chanting. And after that, I take one hour Zazen session. So that's the reason why maybe you feel the power of Zen from me.
Jiani (01:07)
So one hour of my meditation every day.
mikikouj (01:11)
Yes, yes.
Jiani (01:12)
I know this may be digressing us from like the topic that I want to talk about this kind of just question that I'm curious. When you do the Zen meditation every morning, at least what happened on my side is a lot of times a lot of thoughts come into your mind and you're in this constant state of
busy mind and you're like, you know, thoughts after one thoughts after one thoughts and people say when you meditate just see yourself as a mountain or thoughts are clouds but for me it's like the sky is like cloudy it's like all the thoughts and I can't even there's like no blue sky and it's just how and I've maybe my my experience can be can be similar from a lot of our audiences out there. So how do you
mikikouj (01:45)
All right. Yeah.
Jiani (02:04)
manage the busy mind or the thoughts that comes to you when you meditate.
mikikouj (02:08)
Well, it's very natural that you have many thoughts. But for me, it's always busy mind, many jobs, many things to do. But this is a very fast stage. It's like in a glass, there's muddy water. Then the mud...
The mud will go down slowly and slowly and slowly during the zazen session. And finally, the clear water is above the mud, and mud is deep inside of your mind. So if you continue zazen session, then your thought is decreasing, decreasing. The clear water in your glass is above the mud.
So this is kind of how the Zazen session will work for you.
Jiani (03:03)
So I would say minimum an hour would be it or two.
mikikouj (03:08)
It depends on the person but I think it will take about 15 minutes.
Jiani (03:12)
15 minutes. So maybe at the beginning it takes longer for the muddy water to get clear and as you get familiar with it you can gradually condense that. Does music help? Do you use music too?
mikikouj (03:17)
Yeah, many thoughts, many thoughts.
Yeah. Yeah.
Sometimes, sometimes, but I recommend some kind of chanting if you have. Your voice is very powerful. You're hearing your voice by yourself. It's very powerful. So if you have some kind of a special tongue, I don't know what the tongue is, but I always...
chanting by myself.
Jiani (03:55)
And when you chant, should that be a long sentence or a phrase or a word?
mikikouj (04:01)
Very short sentence works for you. Very short sentence. Like, my name is Koji Miki. My name is Koji Miki.
Jiani (04:10)
That's interesting. And you can swap different chanting based on what focus you wanted to focus on in that particular time.
I think what people, when people feel challenged is a lot of times we always feel like we need a long time, like an hour to, or, but usually in the morning time people are so like crazy busy, they need to commute to work and have conferences and it's just hard for us to just sit there for.
longer period of time but I feel like 15 minutes is still totally doable.
mikikouj (04:42)
yeah yes yeah 10 or 15 minutes is really works for you
Jiani (04:49)
Enchanting. I like that.
mikikouj (04:50)
Yes.
Jiani (04:50)
Beautiful.
If you were to introduce yourself to our audience in 30 seconds, how would you do that?
mikikouj (04:57)
my name is Koji Miki. Nice to meet you. I'm co -founder of Zen 2 .0, which is the largest Zen and mindfulness conference in Kamakura (Japan). And 14 years ago, I was running, I was the board member of a small IT company. And at that time, there was a big economic shock. We called it Riemann Shock.
in Japan and because of this economical shock our company's sales is really going down and I was in charge of the IPO of this small IT company but due to this economical shock I could not do my mission and I have to I was laid off from the company.
and I got a deep mental depression because of this incident. And I tried to cure by myself without using any mental drugs because I was very afraid of addiction of mental drugs. So I was searching how to cure my mind.
I searched some videos on YouTube at that time and I found a very nice video of Zazen meditation. By watching this Zazen meditation, I tried to practice my Zazen session. After three months, my mental condition became really good.
During the Zazen session, I hit upon many business ideas. Then after that, I created my own company which helps the people who really create new things by using the 3D printers and laser cutters and things like that. And after that, we started...
innovation school called Zen School which will provide a Zazen session and also innovation workshop for CEOs or startup companies present. Then after that I had to do manage my life by helping Zazen. So I was really
a feeling that thank you feeling for Zen itself. So that's the reason I studied Zen 2 .0 to spread the wisdom of Zen philosophy to the world through the conference. So that was 2015, the first conference, sorry, the first conference in 2017. And this year is eight years of...
at Zen 2 .0.
Jiani (08:00)
Welcome.
mikikouj (08:01)
Surprisingly, the first meeting of Zen 2 .0 was only for four people. Now, almost 500 people gather online and offline in Kamakura. This conference became the largest conference. I'm very...
Surprising.
Jiani (08:28)
Thank you for sharing with us your...
beginning the why behind Zen and innovation and when I was when I first heard about it as like interesting like when whenever we think about Zen it's usually we sit here and doing nothing like just be in the zone and innovation when we think about it's always hustling and implementing acting deciding a lot of actions and
And when your philosophy is trying to integrate Zen, the movement of un -movement with innovation, the movement of movement together, I see this beautiful middle ground. And that's very insightful. And we're probably very curious, so how exactly does it work? Like...
mikikouj (09:16)
Yeah.
Jiani (09:25)
coming back to the experiences where you are doing meditation and then all the business ideas come. How exactly does Zen help facilitate or grow this innovative thinking and ideation? Just very curious.
mikikouj (09:42)
Yeah, yeah. There is an old tradition, old picture of Zen Buddhism. It is called Ten Bulls Ten pictures of the bulls And the story is very simple.
has a cow in his house. And the cow is escaping from his house. And the boy tried to chase, tried to search the cow. So in this picture, the cow means enlightenment.
People always try to find important things outside of your body. But the truth is, the cow is already inside yourself. So the boys tried to chase the cow outside of his house. But finally, he found the cow inside of the boy's house.
So that's a story of the Ten Bulls in business, if you try to find new idea, you will search new idea outside of you. But the reality that new innovation and new idea is already inside yourself.
So just this is a story, just that story of the journey of innovation.
Once you go outside to search new ideas, new design, new technology, but at the end, you find the new things inside of yourself. And you notice that you really focus on your idea, then your business will grow and grow and grow. It's kind of a magical working.
And finally, your business or project will be a big success. After that, you will teach your experience to other people in a very natural way. This is the whole story of Zen Kuros, Zen Buddha.
Jiani (11:50)
So it's always within us. And then the Zen practice.
mikikouj (11:56)
Yeah, always withing us, but people always forget about its insides. So...
So that's a very mysterious, maybe mysterious way of thinking. But this is more than 1 ,000 years of Zen Buddhism is already inside. It's in.
Jiani (12:19)
people develop a product based on the data like the data shows where the world is going, what the world needs. Therefore, products will be based like data based development process.
mikikouj (12:23)
Ah, yes.
Jiani (12:33)
Does that in conflict with the other, you know, the kind of the Zen fullness, great ideas coming from within? How do you see those two different approaches?
mikikouj (12:45)
Now, if you always chasing data, many people can reach this kind of data. So if you find the data, maybe other person can find the same data. So naturally, the product or services will be very similar because of same data.
But if you search inside yourself, your memory or your feeling is very original of you. So there is no competition. This is very unique products or services if you search inside yourself. So this is the basic idea of true innovation.
Jiani (13:32)
I love that. Yeah. Because I think competition has its place to make things from bad, you know, be better, faster, more efficient. I think genuinely ingenuity also has its own place to help elevate our collective flourishing as human beings. Beautiful.
And when you're talking about this Zen and innovation, you also mentioned about there has been talk between the concept of Zen and Ikigai. Are they similar like Zen and innovation versus Ikigai? How do you see the relationship between those two concepts?
mikikouj (14:17)
Yeah, Ikigai is really close to the Zen philosophy. Because if you search inside yourself, you automatically find your Ikigai too. So if you reach your true Ikigai, you're really focusing on your Ikigai. And this is going to be...
very nice innovation too. So Ikigai and innovation is very close. Very close. And the way to find your Ikigai Zen meditation is very effective.
Jiani (14:57)
And when we're doing the Zen practice, integrating, creating space for innovation.
would there be any kind of emotional impact like resilience, problem solving, inclusion, inclusive thinking? So how does this practice based on your experience impact our way to solve problems, to feel and to include others?
mikikouj (15:29)
Yeah, if you're doing the Zazen Meditation for a long time, you can see your mind very clearly from outside of your body. It's kind of, what can I say, observing yourself with a clear mind. So if you have this kind of talent, skill,
Everything is very well, like resilience and creativity. Everything is, how can I say, observing yourself from outside of body. It's like you're watching the movie. You are in the movie, but actually you are outside of a movie from the seat of a...
movie theater.
Jiani (16:20)
So we're kind of watching our own movies and instead of being in a movie, getting lost, we kind of take a step back and say, hey, we are the audience of our own story.
mikikouj (16:29)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, in the movie, the main character is in trouble, but outside of the movie, oh, this is just a movie. You don't care about it. So this kind of emotion skill is very important.
Jiani (16:50)
and I'll see you.
So it's like a detached, healthy detachment. And would that be, would that help us to think more inclusively, to include others, to think and transcend our current perspectives? Will that help?
mikikouj (16:56)
Yeah.
Yeah, of course, if you have very difficult emotion against some kind of person, but you think outside of your body, you notice that you're feeling that something difficult about this person.
and you sense, and you taste your emotion. Then gradually, I'm feeling this way and you can, what can I say, adjust your emotion to the real world. I mean, uh...
It's kind of a slow motion. You will feel your feeling in a very slow, in a very slowly you can feel, gradually you're feeling. Then you can, what can I say, adjust the reality to your emotion. So this connect to the...
inclusiveness. If you talk to other people...
you don't like but you feel your feeling then you can access him or her but observing yourself is very important
Jiani (18:41)
So feel the feeling. Maybe it could be an unpleasant feeling that we're feeling. And...
mikikouj (18:49)
unpleasant, even if you have unpleasant feelings against one, see or him, yourself.
Jiani (18:56)
a person and observe that observe you feeling that unpleasant feeling slowly.
mikikouj (19:07)
Yeah, it's like a same phenomena. You are in the movie. And actually you are outside of the movie screen.
And this main character I feel unpleasant feeling, but anyway, you are audience.
Jiani (19:29)
I think I get what you're trying to say is still put ourselves in that audience perspective and the main character which is you or not you is feeling that sort of discomfort dealing with the other person or the other team and...
you may feel the uncomfortableness because you're trying to embed your emotion in that character but at the same time your brain also knows that you are not that character and you're the audience so there's like a safety net between that person and the like the the authentic the true you.
mikikouj (20:02)
Yeah.
Now, it's actually.
Jiani (20:16)
So that helps to protect you from being totally absorbed and feeling hurt about that emotion and just it's just a character.
mikikouj (20:24)
Exactly. At the same time, you can enjoy this kind of bad condition because this is a movie, an action movie, in a main character in a trouble sometimes, but he or she sometimes get out of this kind of very difficult scene by riding on the bike or, you know...
by the car or something like that. So you can enjoy the difficult situation.
Jiani (20:59)
Yeah and actually we are turning those troubling emotions to actually curiosity, positivity because I'm curious although at this moment this character is feeling bad and the worst time of the day but I'm curious what's the next story would tell and I'm like I'm curious what's next?
mikikouj (21:17)
Yeah, yes.
Yes, yes.
Jiani (21:23)
That's beautiful. So do you think that will in a startup or organization environment where leaders are leading a team and teams are collaborating with each other? How would the Zen and innovation practice help the team enhance?
group empathy. So it's not just like a person but it's like a group of people, a team. Will that be having like a group effect versus like just individual effect?
mikikouj (21:57)
Yeah, actually there is a group effect if you sit together as a team, maybe 10 or 15 minutes sitting together. After the Zen meditation, then you will have deep dialogue within team members. And normally, what can I say, the ego is a...
big but after the tense meditation your ego will be very calm and slow down. So in this kind of situation at the atmosphere you can very naturally and directly eat with other members. So this is very effective to make a team building after the Zazen session.
Jiani (22:49)
So everybody's water is muddy at the beginning as a group and as each other's cup of water get pure and pure the whole group's energy and dynamics become pure and pure. It's beautiful. What in that in this in this process you know Zen and innovation what role do you think
mikikouj (22:51)
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
Nice.
Jiani (23:15)
Does the childlike wonder, curiosity play in the whole process?
mikikouj (23:21)
curiosity.
Jiani (23:23)
childlike wonder, curiosity.
mikikouj (23:26)
After the Zazen meditation, you will notice very tiny things. You will notice that very slight emotional change of other persons because your sense is very... your sensitivity really goes up. Listen to the person's voice.
you can hear that emotional change. You can see the other person's face. You can feel the other person's emotion according to the other person's change of face. So your sense will be very sharp. And by this kind of effect,
you can notice many things if you compare with before the transition. So this kind of effect will help to hint new ideas.
Jiani (24:39)
when we are in the space of genuinely curious and genuinely creative, are we sort of like we have this like little kid is alive and then the little kid is giving us ideas when we search within are we searching into the childlike self that we have? Yeah.
mikikouj (25:03)
Yeah, I understand. In my session, Zen school session, during Zen meditation, we try to remember 10 years boy or girl age, especially summer vacation time. And by using this kind of workshop, many people...
Jiani (25:05)
I'm just curious.
mikikouj (25:26)
clearly remember that excitement feeling at that time when you are 10 years old. So this kind of excitement is really connected to your Ikigai, also to innovation. Because you feel, you felt the excitement at that time. That's a...
always connected to what you really want to do. So...
That's our methodology of Zen school.
Jiani (25:59)
That's interesting. Can you share with us a little bit more about how things are being taught in the Zen school?
mikikouj (26:07)
We usually use our technique, the Waku Waku Treasure Hunting Charm. It's to remember 10 years ago, your girl. So our technique is only one thing. That's the only one. Only one.
Jiani (26:25)
Only one, the child, the remember the 10 year old you and what you enjoy doing.
mikikouj (26:29)
Yeah, yeah. And this very simple technique is really connected to your Ikigai or innovation, everything. So that's a very interesting thing that we found. Ten years of boy or girl memory is very effective to hold your whole life.
everything.
normally, usually this kind of childhood memories reconnect to the person's ikigai or true intention of life. So, if we continue this kind of dialogue a long time, in the end...
maybe you can reach. That's the reason why I'm doing this job, because of that memory as a child.
Jiani (27:31)
I love that. Yeah, I think the podcast definitely is filling up a big chunk of a bit. So yeah, that part I'm grateful. So how about you? What did you enjoy doing when you were...
mikikouj (27:44)
Yeah, yeah, I was a 10 years boy. I am very good at diving into the water, diving into the ocean. And during some vacation, I go back to my father's hometown, which is Shikoku, Takamatsu area. And in...
this beautiful ocean I sometimes dive into the ocean and try to find treasure like a small shell or rocks diving into the deep ocean and I found very treasure.
during the diving into the ocean. My job right now is to find other person's treasure, dive into each person's mind. It's the same thing.
Jiani (28:37)
That's beautiful. So you're fulfilling your child or your key guy.
mikikouj (28:43)
Yeah, I'm really feeling my kigai with my job.
Jiani (28:48)
I love that.
Yeah, I think it's a good feeling when we are able to get connected with that inner self at a younger age and being able as adults to fulfill that drive and mission with an adult mind, with strategy and with discipline and with long -term thinking.
I think it's one of the best feelings that we can ever feel. So what do you think is your magic overall?
mikikouj (29:22)
Have a great.
I think magic is very close to our methodology. Do you think so?
Jiani (29:34)
Yeah.
mikikouj (29:35)
Childishness is very important to create new things, to make innovation. Almost all the other person forget about their dream when they are 10 years boy or girl. But remember the excitement, that is very important.
the whole life of each person.
Jiani (30:01)
Yes. So we hope our audience after hearing this story is going to ask ourselves a question. What did I enjoy doing when I was 10? And am I doing that now? Do I feel like a key guy? Am I creating? Am I building? Am I innovating? That's beautiful.
That's so beautiful. Thank you Koji. And for our audience out there, we've talked about, let's give kind of quick recap. We talked about the story behind Koji and his initiative and venture in Zen 2 .0, a global conference exploring Zen and innovation. We talked about how Zen...
mikikouj (30:30)
Wonderful.
Jiani (30:52)
practice can help us be more innovative, help us be more empathetic, help us be more inclusive. No matter if you are by yourself or you are leading a team, it's helping us to get that muddy water.
give it time, give it space to let it calm down and show that clear part of the water and get things cleared out. And we also talked about the importance of childlike play, childlike wonder. One of the key methodology that Koji uses in his Zen and Business Innovation School is to ask folks what did they enjoy doing when they were 10 or 11 years old.
mikikouj (31:21)
Thanks.
Jiani (31:40)
when they want to those summer time summer vacation what they enjoy doing what they enjoy creating and ask that important question are you still doing it at current stage of your life and that that would be the key kind of compass for us to find our IKI. Very beautiful and as the kind of the technology moving forward faster and faster we have artificial intelligence we have
mikikouj (31:50)
That's it.
Jiani (32:09)
Thank you Koji. So for folks who wanted to get in contact with Koji...
get to know Zen 2 .0 conference, follow him around, his contact information and all the links are in the show notes below. So just feel free and we encourage you to get connected and explore the space of Zen and innovation. Thank you so much for being our guest Koji to MAGICademy today.
mikikouj (32:31)
Thanks.
Thank you very much for inviting me to such a wonderful chat. Yes.
Jiani (32:48)
Thank you very much.
