How Magic Teaches Us About Trust and Innovation | Mike Hruska
What if the secret to breakthrough innovation isn't found in boardrooms or laboratories, but in the surprising world of stage magic? Mike Hruska, a technologist and recovered magician, reveals how illusion principles can transform how we approach change, build trust, and solve complex problems.
The Paradox of Trusted Deception
Here's a mind-bending question: Why do we instantly trust people who have been lying to us for years?
"Think about your favorite actor or your favorite musician," Hruska explains. "You know, what they're normally doing is not real, right? The band that you love that makes the music that you love, is not them. That is just an extension of them. The actor that you see on the stage... they're acting. That is deception."
Yet if you met that actor tomorrow, you'd believe every word they said. This paradox reveals something profound about human psychology: we don't just tolerate deception—we actively seek it out and find it delightful. The key difference? Context and consent. When deception is framed as art, entertainment, or education, it becomes a gift rather than a betrayal.
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MAGICademy Podcast (00:00)
Magician suspends disbelief. You can simplify it to something appears or something disappears. Something transforms. There's teleportation. We think that we can see the future in front of us, but the future is actually around the corner. There's a difference between possible and impossible and not possible yet. And so if we can get in the right head space, then we can see around the corner. Collaborations allows us to take people in that shared journey. And if it's a shared journey towards change,
where everyone's involved in some way, you're building trust. And when you get to the surprise, it will most often lead to delight.
Jiani (00:42)
we've talked about.
leveraging the magic maker mindset to create environments and potentially systems for folks to be more willing and feel safer to take risks and make changes. And actually, one of his philosophy is to guide people to see around the corner and
we ventured into this metaphor of like trees have roots and they grow roots poke a hole in what they perceive as reality and just venture into that new possibilities
of a different reality that they would be joyful to see and to live in and to experience. We also talked about the possible future where we have all the technologies. everyone will personalize the amounts, the timing, the content,
meeting people where they are exactly where they needed and give them exactly what they need so they can grow the seed of their new roots into the new realities and perceptions that they need to go. a pure magical
Welcome to MAGICademy podcast. Today we have a special guest, Mike. He's a technologist, a designer, solution seeker, maker, problem solver, entrepreneur, and A recovered magician. Can I say that? Yeah. Wonderful. So for today's conversation, we will deep dive into the connection between
Mike Hruska (02:04)
You can say that for sure.
Jiani (02:13)
creating magic, experiencing magic, and finding solutions and see change as your experience of magic,
How do you define magic?
Mike Hruska (02:26)
Well, that's a really good question. So Arthur C. Clarke says that any sufficiently advanced technology is nearly indistinguishable from magic. And so you can think about any technology that we have today, going back in time, 20 years or 50 years or a hundred years would completely blow people's minds. They might have a hard time understanding what it even is. So you imagine when electricity was discovered, we didn't invent it. We discovered the potential of electricity. If you think back in time,
There were the immediate thought was, well, we need to make light bulbs. And then eventually people thought, well, wait, we can make electric motors. And when the electric motor was invented, that radically changed the factory. Right. But when people were inventing light bulbs and electric motors, no one thought about the hundreds of things that you might plug into outlets in your house, like a hairdryer or an electric toothbrush or a leaf blower or any of those things. And so those were eventualities from the discovery.
electricity. The other way to think about magic is the art of magic, which what you know as magic is something that causes you surprise and always delight. Even when the woman appears to be sawed in half, she's not really sawed in half. And you're surprised that it actually happened, but you're delighted that she's still alive. And that's amazing. But what you know as magic, the magician in reverse knows as deception, which is a very interesting topic in and of itself.
But I think magic is that in everything magic is technology Magic is change Magic is The sense of discovery that we feel together and then when we unveil that future that's around the corner That's not intuitively obvious to us
Jiani (04:13)
Yeah, I think in one of your tech talk, you were talking about like magic is like to see a rabbit get pulled out of a hat. It's this kind of state of like joy, pleasant joy, and also they're experiencing some sort of like change. They have a set of perceptions and then all of a sudden what they've seen actually violate that sort of pre perceptions and they welcomely accept the new perceptions that they are seeing. Exactly. It feel like
the process of ideally how we can experience change as well.
Mike Hruska (04:46)
Yeah, I
know totally agree. mean, magic essentially violates our sense of reality at a fundamental level. What we believe is possible and what we believe is impossible, we bring that viewpoint of what's not possible yet into our world. And that's what opens up our mind for the potentials of change in many ways. It opens up our balloon of belief.
Jiani (05:09)
Yeah.
Yeah, and then that ties back to your mission is to help people see change around the corner. It's like around the corner of their perceptions in a surprisingly joyful, joyful way. That's amazing.
Mike Hruska (05:23)
Yeah, mean,
I call it talking about around the corner. I just call it going perpendicular. Right. if you if you if you you look at natural systems like fractals, like trees and other things, as they grow, they they branch and form roots. And and you know, in my viewpoint, so so does our life and so does and so does reality. And so if we're able to think about that, there are branches out there. We can think around the corner on a branch and come back and tell ourselves.
What is this future? What magic do I need to do in order to get to this thing that is not possible yet?
Jiani (06:08)
that's kind of just like if we see our perceptions at the root of a tree and you're basically helping them to grow new starting point for root, to help them grow their perceptions. I love that. You are currently working on a magic design canvas helping people to seek.
Mike Hruska (06:21)
Yes, exactly.
Jiani (06:31)
solutions, not just to seek solutions but to understand the problems. Can you share with us a little bit more on that canvas for a solution?
Mike Hruska (06:43)
Yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely. So, you know, there, there were a couple seeds that grew branches in my world along the way. When I was at the National Institute of Standards and Technology, had a lovely mentor and boss and he would, he would quip quotes at me and ask me, what does it mean? And one day he said, Einstein said, we can't use the same consciousness to solve a problem that created it. What does it mean? And so as, as I always did, I thought about things for a few days and finally,
Finally, I came back and said, well, I think that what Einstein was saying in my words was in order to do differently, we need to think differently. So we need to change our mindset if we want to change our doing and change our beliefs, changes our actions and change the results. And fundamentally, people are very good problem solvers. We step right in. As soon as we see a problem, we solve it. Unfortunately, people don't always do that with litter.
When I see litter, I pick it up, right? And that litter is a problem. my sort of fundamental belief is that people are great
reporting problems, but we're not good at articulating the problem. And if you can articulate a problem well enough, like all the edges of the problem, then the solution will form in the middle, like a donut, like the center. And so if we want to do differently, we need to think differently and we need to be able to articulate our problems extremely well. Often we solve problems before we understand them. And what happens is that creates more problems for us. And you know, what is a problem? Problems comes
Jiani (08:00)
Hmm.
Mike Hruska (08:18)
Pro and blamos, meaning something thrown in front of us. And you hear it in evidence in our language. You hear people say, we'll get out of this, we'll get over this, we'll get through this. And what they're referring to is the obstacle between them and the outcome or the up. Yeah, but really what we need to be focused on is the outcome. Where do we seek to get to? What is our goal? What is
Jiani (08:32)
to avoid the problems.
Mike Hruska (08:41)
What is the state that we want to be in and focus less on the problems and always keep our North Star, articulate our problems well, the solution appears in the middle, like the center of a donut. And that's what keeps us focused as problem solvers or change makers.
a good example. So when I talked about the violation of reality, there's work from Lindsay and Gerald Zaltman. They wrote a book called Marketing Metaphoria. And inside of their work, they talk about the fact that we anchor our reality around seven giant metaphors, balance, container, control, connection, journey, resource and transformation.
And I was working on a project and Lindsay Zoltman was on the project and he displayed all these metaphors on the screen. And I said, wait a second, hold on. Magic violates our fundamental reality metaphor. So if you learn to ride a bike in Canada or Argentina, you understand balance, right? You would know if I grabbed my coffee cup, I couldn't balance it on this finger. But if I did balance it on this finger, that would be kind of magical in some ways. And
Metaphors are really important anchor for our reality. So back in probably 2006 and 2007, started to look at learning technology and the SCORM standard that we all know from LMS content and other things, had really good intention. But ultimately, there's a bigger view for what tracking learning could do. And today with artificial intelligence,
having all the data about our interactions with other people is really interesting. And so if you look at what SCORM was and the concept of an LMS and you look at what the metaphor was, it was about resources, courses that we put in a container, the LMS, right? But if you think about what should the magic of learning be in the future, it's about connecting people to people and people to experiences. And so the future metaphor that you might think about at that point in
was a connected journey, right? And so I started to work with a group of folks on what's today known as the experience API. And that's all about connected journeys, connecting people to people and connecting people to experiences. So when we think about learning, you know, the, the, and the metaphor still persists about resources in a container courses in the LMS, right? But learning is really a journey and learning is connecting to the right people.
and the right experiences through our time, whether they're real world experiences or digital experiences in some way. So worked really many years with the advanced distributed learning initiative to develop what's known as the experience API today. And so that's sort of a macro sort of global definition of how you can take metaphors associated with metaphor violation and magic and think about framing new metaphors to move to in terms of transformation.
Jiani (11:52)
Hmm. Can you help us understand a little bit about like the experience API? What is that? Is that related to virtual realities, Web3 and blockchain or it's just a different way
of launching courses going beyond the traditional scorn packages.
Mike Hruska (12:17)
Yeah, so if I was going to explain it to my dad, I would say, dad, imagine that my little brother followed me around everywhere and everything that I did wrote a little receipt and put it in a box. So if you could take that box of all those receipts and take all the other boxes of all the receipts from the other people and put that together in a data set, you've had some really interesting things. one example, so the experience API essentially is a JSON or JavaScript object notation format for collecting actor verb object.
context, result, and extension. So Jiani read this book, Mike attended this course, or Mike flew this helicopter simulator under the following task conditions and standards and was assessed on the following things and performed in the following way. So experience API was an evolution of the SCORM that allows a lot more rich data to be connected in meaningful ways so that we could replicate learning paths, whether
sort of the standard learning path or a different type of learning path along the way. We can collect data to know what should I do next? What should I do more of? What should I do less of? It's essentially, I would, I don't know how much hiking you've done, but in the hiking world, there's something known as a cairn, which is a little stack of rocks, an unnatural stack of something that's natural. And those are guide points for you along your journey.
So imagine that you had a bunch of people that went through their learning journeys, but through the Experience API, we're able to capture a lot of those Karens along the way and then guide others behind them on their learning journeys.
Jiani (13:57)
I love that. It's kind of like a qualitative or text based digital footprints information of some sorts in a designed controlled learning experience environment. That's interesting.
Mike Hruska (14:06)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, it's
a simple way to track things, to accumulate data and to use that data to micro -adapt and macro -adapt learning experiences.
Jiani (14:23)
I like that. can definitely see this being widely used in the virtual reality because in virtual reality there are just so many descriptive data about the experience of that particular person in the environment. If you are taking a digital course, it's kind of simpler. It's like when, how long, this person logged on, did what course, and did how much ratings on the quizzes and all of that.
Mike Hruska (14:52)
Yeah, in simulated environments or VR, AR, other things, know, beyond a course in the LMS, you can get a lot of extremely rich data about how the person's behaving inside of it. Thinking of that, you can take data from other people and you can adapt inside of the experience. And when I finished the experience, maybe I was really good on a number of things, maybe not so good on others, and it might recommend a next step in the learning path for some kind of remediation.
Jiani (14:52)
I think, yeah.
It's kind of as if you have someone monitoring you and collecting and observing not only more of like a behavior data rather than just simple one -dimensional data.
Mike Hruska (15:34)
Yeah, you can make it as rich as you want as a designer.
Jiani (15:44)
Cool. Alright. Sorry for rerouting our conversation a little bit because it's just so interesting that you've shared this topic. Let's come back to the concept of magic. And you shared about some basic principles and stages of magic. setting the stage, make believe experiences, and then following some sort
basic principles of magic. Can you help us understand a little bit more
Mike Hruska (16:13)
Yeah, I mean, it's interesting. So if you can think back to a time when you've seen magic, whether that's street magic or maybe magic even in a theater, first, there's the there's the general context of being there. The magician sets the stage. The magician suspends disbelief. That's a fundamental thing along the way. Then there's a shared journey towards surprise. And that surprise always ends in delight.
People are always amazed consistently over and over again. Even though some people feel that they don't want to be fooled, they'll still go to see magic in some ways. Now think about change on the other hand. There's the context, the stage is set for the merger, the acquisition, or whatever it might be in the context of the corporate environment. Belief isn't always suspended.
There's a shared journey that people have and then there's surprise and most often it doesn't lead to delight. It leads to some kind of like confused or anxiety state in some ways. what one of the fundamental questions I've been asking for since probably 2008 is how can we learn from magic to always create delight from the surprise? What can we learn from the design of illusion?
Jiani (17:11)
anxiety.
Mike Hruska (17:31)
the understanding of deception, the concepts of trust that will enable us as change makers to create surprises that most often lead to delight. And I think there's a lot there. And so, you know, there are a bunch of principles in magic that you might consider along the way, you know, big motion covers small motion. Sometimes something large will happen on the stage, but there's one little thing that changes and that's what sets the opportunity for the deception, which a magician knows from
their viewpoint to be magic in some ways.
Jiani (18:04)
So how, if we were to facilitate change and help people to perceive change in a more, kind of through a more pleasant lens, can you walk us through like how,
Mike Hruska (18:17)
Yeah, absolutely. so from my magic maker canvas or the magic maker mindset, right? So we've got to have an outcome that we're seeking to get to. And then there's always a problem to be solved and a solution. And between problems and solutions, there's a little bit of a cycle, right? Who is involved with the problem? What are they thinking? What's the context of the problem? And if you can articulate that problem well enough, then we can really start to understand.
what that solution space looks like along the way. The other fundamental thing is understanding the anchor metaphors that people are ground in their current reality. So like the LMS example of resources in a container in some ways. And then thinking about the future metaphors that people need to anchor around in some ways. Ultimately, you got to understand, what is the climax and what are the effects? know, in magic, we have
a range of effects. Dario Fitzkee had some really good work on this. Whether you think there's seven or 11, 13 or 17 different effects, you can simplify it to something appears or something disappears. Something transforms. There's teleportation. If I tear a newspaper apart and then restore it, there's a restoration in some ways. And so if you think about Blackberry, right, Blackberry had a super successful business model.
But then they started to get their market share eroded along the way. so there might be some metaphors that were inherent in their design of their organization, but there needed to be future metaphors. But the magic that BlackBerry needed to perform was a restoration in some ways. And if you think about a team in an organization that's trying to do something new, they might be trying to make something appear, or they might be trying to teleport, which means moving from
to a space very quickly that you can't even imagine in some way. So understanding the effects that might apply to something out of the magic effects that are there, understanding the anchor metaphor and the future metaphors helps us understand how to use our language to start to help people see what the potential future is around the corner. Helping people to suspend their disbelief allows us to have the opportunity to build trust in collaborations and building trust in collaborate.
Collaborations allows us to take people in that shared journey. And if it's a shared journey towards change, where everyone's involved in some way, you're building trust. And when you get to the surprise, it will most often lead to
I can use a really good local example. So I'm I'm in a small town in western Pennsylvania called Johnstown, Pennsylvania, and it has a history of being wrecked in 1889. We had one of the largest natural disasters in the country. A dam broke and flooded and killed thousands of people here and the community rebuilt.
Jiani (20:59)
Mm -mm.
Mike Hruska (21:16)
And it was an early opportunity for Clara Barton and the Red Cross to actually have an impact on people. The town flooded again in 1936 and again in 1977. It had a vibrant steel industry that ultimately left the town. the town has a lot of resilient people. So I moved back here after leaving DC in 2004, back to my home area. And what I saw
people were anchored on certain metaphors along the way. And so I helped to start a young professionals organization. And through that young professionals organization, started to see that there was an emerging young group of people in the community that were really extremely interested in change and started to work with individuals in that community. You're going to say something, ahead. Restoration metaphor. yes, exactly. Restoration and then restoration of fact.
Jiani (22:02)
Restoration metaphor.
Ha ha ha!
Mike Hruska (22:11)
and transformation metaphor, right? And transformation metaphor came through building connections, building a social fabric. And so, built a young professionals organization here, which created the connections. And those connections led to the ideas of transformation. Many people from that organization started to do their own grassroots sort of things to build the community, whether that was accelerating a nonprofit or building a nonprofit
building community projects in some way. This ultimately led to another type of interstitial organization that was called Lift Johnstown. In Lift Johnstown, community leaders from a bunch of organizations formed a new organization that was starting to connect the pieces in meaningful ways. So we had this bottom up emerging young professional community and an upper community that was connecting.
And ultimately that led to funding that has helped to build communities for startups and co -working spaces and a ton of things. it's been a long, I would say 20 years, but to see that sort of magic unfolding in the community and to see the momentum that's happened as a result of sort of thoughtful and deliberate design of communities and engagement has been really fascinating. And it's one of the case studies that
that I'll illuminate further in the book that I'm working
Jiani (23:35)
keep me posted once you have this book coming to the market, we will give a shout out to the community. That's, yes, that's a great story. And coming back to the context of like organizations, startup, and kind of a company of people who are working on a particular solution for a particular group of people.
Mike Hruska (23:44)
Sounds awesome. You'll be the first to know.
Jiani (23:58)
How can leaders leverage or harness the magic of magic to build or at least start building the foundations of a culture where it is truly inclusive beyond the politics and it's innovative and risk -taking?
are welcome and the risk of making a mistake is minimized and managed and people are feeling encouraged to experience, to experiment, to lead or contribute to changes and adaptations in a time of like uncertainty such as a time right
Mike Hruska (25:02)
We live in a certain time of uncertainty, don't we?
Jiani (25:05)
Yes, that means
we have many opportunities to make magic.
Mike Hruska (25:10)
They're they're all over the place right and that's the magic maker mindset of possible not possible and not possible yet and if you want to get a Team to have a shared dream Then you need to build trust and trust is a really interesting thing. It means believe what I say Believe that I can do what I say and believe that when I do it. It's not just for me. It's for the we around
And trust has a lot of components and sincerity and honesty and competency along the way. So building trust is the number one thing. If you can build trust, then you can suspend disbelief. Then you can help other people see possibilities around them or what Dave Gray, the big design thinking guru calls possibilitarianism. And so if you can build a team and you can find a shared dream with trust,
you can make that team into a bunch of possibilitarians. And possibilitarians are always working towards what is not possible yet. And that's the most optimal blend for a group of game changer change makers. know, three people in a dream can change the world is the fundamental design pattern. And it really takes three. Why three? I don't know, but the most successful startups have three successful founders working together. Maybe not two, maybe not one, maybe not six, but it's three. And if you look
at least at one level of fundamentally what matter is made out of. It's made out of electrons, protons and neutrons. Three things. One is the anchor, the proton. One is the electron creates the space, it's the energy and the neutron is the balancing force. So three people and a dream can totally change the world if you embody trust, if you think and can build your skills as game changer change makers and if you believe in the possibilitarianism.
Jiani (27:03)
I know this is another side question. Can we create trust fast or trust is something that we need to build upon at least for years?
Mike Hruska (27:14)
So it's interesting. So I don't know if you've ever heard of the concept, the shadow of the future. The shadow of the future is something interesting. And it's a gauge that I use to understand a lot about people. So if you know that you're going to have an interaction with another person in the future, people will often treat them differently than someone you think you will never see again. You might walk by a homeless person and completely ignore them.
because you think I will never see them again. They might not be consequential to my life, but there's nothing wrong with saying hello to them. Dealing with a waitress or a waiter in a scenario, you think you may never see them again, but I learn a lot about people from the way that they treat others. I try to live in the shadow of the future all the time, and I really appreciate when people live in the shadow of the future.
Trust is this really interesting thing. So I want you to think about this for a second. Think about your favorite actor or your favorite musician or maybe a celeb or favorite podcast host, right? You know, what they're normally doing is not real, right? The band that you love that makes the music that you love, is not them. That is just an extension of them. The actor that you see on the stage
Jiani (28:20)
podcast host.
Mike Hruska (28:38)
on a film in some ways, they're acting. That is deception. That is a form of art and art is a form of deception. And so if you met them, if you met your favorite actor, Jiani you'd believe everything they say, even though everything you know of them is a complete lie and complete deception in some ways. So that's an interesting sort of thing to think about in some ways. And so, yeah, go ahead.
Jiani (29:01)
If I
see the actor in the TV show or in the movie, just, totally buy into that. That's for
Mike Hruska (29:09)
Right,
yeah, because you are believing the illusion and you're taking the deception as reality in some ways. So it's interesting that we trust things that we're being deceived with. Now, if you met the actor, you'd believe every word they say, even though they've only ever lied to you if you believe that acting is a form of deception in some ways. And so I think there's an interesting balance here with building trust.
I think trust can be built quickly if you are acting and creating a bit of surprise. Maybe saying things that might be slightly different than what someone expects. Now that could go quite wrong, of course, right? You could say something that someone doesn't expect and they're surprised but they are not delighted. So when we engage with people, we need to think about the creating surprise and creating delight.
because that's what builds trust over and over and over
Jiani (30:07)
I love that.
in the future looking to the bigger picture what kind of best possible
probable future you can envision as we continuously develop humanity -wise and technology -wise, what would that look like?
Mike Hruska (30:36)
I'll just go down to the fundamental. It is something that we all have to do every day. Everyone needs to eat. Education and healthcare are extremely important to changing our lives and having impact. With what has happened with AI in recent times, I think there's a huge opportunity to enhance the fundamentals of humanity. And that means finding ways to get the
right amount of the right things to the right people for their consumption, right? We are what we eat. so, you know, imagine a world in the future, you know, think around the corner as a possibilitarian, where every person, their hunger is satisfied, and it's satisfied in, you know, happy and healthy ways. Imagine that every person is able to receive the education that they need to receive at the right point in time, just for them.
in meaningful ways and imagine that healthcare is something that is immediately available to those that need it just as much as they need it when they need it at an extremely low cost. And so if we can get past all the organizational disruptions and industry disruptions and all the things that are going to be happening over the next few years as a result of AI, if we fundamentally think about what can change in humanity, it's food, education and healthcare.
And that's what excites me about the potentials for technology as a possibilitarian.
Jiani (32:06)
I and thank you for sharing that and and wouldn't that be just from the beginning of the humanity this is something that we've always wanted and I feel like finally now we have the tools the technologies to potentially help us get there finally feels like it's a big circle we're like just like coming coming maybe to a conclusion of a kind of potential
utopia stage and then we can continuously evolve and people may have different higher needs or something like that.
Mike Hruska (32:44)
Yeah, but I think, but I know I think that it would be hard to argue that it's not a fundamental right for people to to eat, to learn and to live. And that any leader in any country and any ideology or, you know, any person on the street would would have to agree with that. There just so many things that we're focused on. You know, we think about.
Jiani (32:46)
on the
Mike Hruska (33:10)
economy and we think about jobs and we think about all of these other things, but fundamentally every person kind of deserves these rights. And I think that's something that over the next few years, hopefully, that humanity can really start to adapt and adopt towards these.
Jiani (33:27)
appreciate that. Any potential challenges, guardrails that you can also see alongside with all the beautiful probabilities.
Mike Hruska (33:37)
Well, I
think fundamentally, you're going to see a few kinds of organizations if we just focus on the idea of economy, their companies and their private companies and their companies with shareholders. And so we're going to see a couple of different types of leaders emerging in organizations. One is the leader that says, I want to use artificial intelligence to have less employees to do what we do today, or I want to have less employees and I want to do
But I think the emerging leaders that people will want to be around and the companies that people will want to work for will have a be more, do more attitude. So can we use AI to unlock the humanity inside of our organizations? Can we use AI to develop a greater sense of purpose? Can we use AI to make more meaningful work, removing the mundane tasks, and so that we have a more humanistic connection and more humanistic service jobs?
inside of organizations. So I think we'll see a gravitation towards the companies that have a be more, do more attitude. the organizational landscape is going to change. It's already changing from, you know, from what I'm seeing with my work in industry, but 2025 and 2026, we're going to see massive disruptions in markets. We're going to see large companies with layoffs. I mean, we've just seen it, you know, into it off 10 % of their people. There are a bunch of other organizations that are doing that. But
hopeful as a possibilitarian that there will be more be more do more attitude leaders in organizations and that those organizations will thrive and have vibrancy towards flourishing in this new future.
Jiani (35:20)
I love that. before we move into the magic part of the conversation, I would like to give a brief recap of everything. A few highlights of everything that
we've talked about.
leveraging the magic maker mindset to create environments and potentially systems for folks to be more willing and feel safer to take risks and make changes. And actually, one of his philosophy is to guide people to see around the corner and
we ventured into this metaphor of like trees have roots and they grow roots poke a hole in what they perceive as reality and just venture into that new possibilities
of a different reality that they would be joyful to see and to live in and to experience. We also talked about the possible future where we have all the technologies. everyone will personalize the amounts, the timing, the content,
meeting people where they are exactly where they needed and give them exactly what they need so they can grow the seed of their new roots into the new realities and perceptions that they need to go. a pure magical
Thank you, Mike, for sharing your insights and wisdom on that. And what is your, like,
favorite thing to do or favorite time to spend with yourself or with people around you that time to disappear when you were 11 or 16 or earlier, whichever age group that you wanted to share.
Mike Hruska (37:03)
Yeah, you know,
didn't think this as the metaphor then, but you know, art is how we decorate space. Music is how we decorate time and food is how we decorate experience. so those are the pastimes that for me that make time disappear. Whether I'm drawing or designing something, visual,
time just stops. If I'm playing music or writing music or recording music or improvising, time just stops as well. And if I'm in the kitchen and I'm working on an experiment or just trying to perfect experiment for something new or trying to perfect something that I've done before, time also just disappears. And so I think that art, music and food are those things for me that make time just stand still.
Jiani (37:57)
The food for your soul. Your anchor to the reality. A joyful anchor to the reality. Amazing.
Do you still play music? What music instrument do you play?
Mike Hruska (38:06)
I play guitar and
mandolin and banjo and piano and bass and drums and harmonica.
Jiani (38:12)
What? That's a lot. my goodness.
Mike Hruska (38:14)
I've had a long time. been playing
piano since I was eight and guitar since I was 10. And so I love playing music. It's fun to play by yourself and it's one of the best things to play with other people. The joy that you can create by playing music with other people is wonderful for the people that are playing it, but it's also wonderful for the people that are hearing
Jiani (38:34)
If you were to play the guitar now, would you feel comfortable doing that?
Mike Hruska (38:41)
Oh, yeah, yeah,
absolutely. I was I was playing last night. I tried to play at least 10 minutes a day because that's a good meditative time to kind of like let the brain make the connections that it makes. I was at a party and a friend of mine, I knew he was going to party and he's a guitar player. And I said, bring your guitar. We're going to play music for people. And we did. And it was lovely. And people were entertained and I was entertained and he was entertained. And he and I were entertained together by.
the magic they were creating because we had no plan. I didn't know all the songs that he knew and he didn't know all the songs that I knew. So we were learning and teaching each other on the fly and collaborating and jamming and it was really quite lovely.
fun fact that you probably don't know about me is after my freshman year of college, I quit college and spent four and a half years touring in a band around the country. And then I ultimately went back to college and then worked in the government research space. yeah, music's such a fundamental part of my
everything shapes us. So you hear people say like, I'm at a fork in the road. But I always believe that there are three possibilities, you know, at those points in time. And so, you know, as I was leaving college, you know, I could have gone into the oil industry, I had an opportunity to go in to the oil industry, I could have continued the research that I was doing.
and could have gone to grad school and studied with one amazing PhD for the area of research I was interested in. But through relationships, by connecting to other people, I got an opportunity to work at the National Institute of Standards and Technology. And so I think the biggest challenges are choice, because the choices that we make really set us up for new worlds in some ways. And so I think the challenge is that...
that I often have and I think that other people have too, are understanding the choices that are in front of us. And the hardest part about making a decision is knowing you have enough information to make it. And so I still don't know what I want to do when I grow up. Actually, I do. I just want to like cook and talk to chefs and talk about food, that's a different, yeah, that's a different world. Well, if you want to see some of my work and that my wife and I have a food media.
Jiani (40:49)
That's great.
Mike Hruska (40:54)
called Two Gastronauts. It's on YouTube and Instagram and Facebook and twogastronauts .com, the number two G astronauts. And so we explore food and wine and we just did some chocolate tastings and other things to explore and celebrate that art of food. you know, I think that always the fundamental challenge is illuminating the choices are in front of us and seeing which road to take.
Jiani (41:20)
I appreciate that. would definitely for folks who are out there if you're a food passionista or passionist definitely check that out as well. That's great. So last question. What do you think is your magic as of now?
Mike Hruska (41:39)
my magic is, it's the same magic I've had since I was a kid. I can remember being in high school and being in band and I had an amazing teacher that taught me about music and discipline and rehearsal and all these things. But I was also an ornery child and was always doing some thing to disrupt things in some ways. And so I can remember one day Mr. Badalowski grabbed me by the neck.
pushed me into the wall and said, you have a choice kid, you're gonna go to jail or you're gonna be the CEO of a company. And I reflected on that experience and what I realized was that I was capable of getting people together, find a team, find a shared dream and do something. And you could do really not so good things with that gift, but if you really focus the gift of bringing people together and helping people see a possible future.
that you could do some pretty amazing things. And so my magic is really bringing my team together, teams in my community together, teams inside of our clients together, and helping people find that possibilitarianism and then move towards that change in the future.
Jiani (42:47)
I appreciate that. I appreciate the teacher who offered you a moment to grow your, the extra root for your perceptions at that time. Totally, I think that changed you as well, creating that future where you're currently living.
Mike Hruska (43:04)
He gave me bit of surprise and ultimately
after some reflection a bit of delight.
Jiani (43:08)
Yes, it's magic. You're living the magic and you're helping people to create more magic. Love that. Thank you Mike for sharing your magic with us today and for folks who want to learn more about Mike's work and dedication and his magic space. His information is in the show note below so please please please connect with him and let your magical journey start.
Mike Hruska (43:34)
Thank
Jiani (43:35)
And don't forget to check out his food channel too. Sounds fun.
Mike Hruska (43:38)
Thank
you so much for having me. It's been lovely being with you.
Jiani (43:41)
same here.
The Seven Metaphors of Reality
Research by Lindsay and Gerald Zaltman in their book "Marketing Metaphoria" reveals that our perception of what's possible is anchored in seven fundamental metaphors that shape our reality:
balance
container
control
connection
journey
resource
transformation
"Magic violates our fundamental reality metaphor," Hruska notes. When a magician balances a coffee cup on a single finger, they're not just performing a trick—they're challenging our deeply held beliefs about how the world works.
This insight has profound implications for innovation. Consider the evolution of learning technology. Traditional e-learning was built on the metaphor of "resources in a container"—courses stored in a Learning Management System. But Hruska envisioned a different metaphor: "connected journeys" that link people to people and experiences. This shift in metaphor led to the creation of the Experience API, fundamentally changing how we think about and track learning.
The Magic Formula for Change
Every successful magic performance follows a predictable pattern that change-makers can learn from:
Setting the stage: Creating the right context for transformation
Suspending disbelief: Helping people become open to new possibilities
Creating shared journeys: Building collective investment in the outcome
Surprise that leads to delight: Ensuring positive emotional outcomes
Traditional change management often fails at the final step. "There's the context, the stage is set for the merger, the acquisition, or whatever it might be," Hruska observes.
“There’s a shared journey that people have, and then there’s surprise, and most often it doesn’t lead to delight. It leads to some kind of confused or anxiety state.”
The Shadow of the Future
Trust isn't just about past performance—it's about future expectations. Hruska introduces the concept of "the shadow of the future": how our knowledge of future interactions shapes present behavior. "If you know that you're going to have an interaction with another person in the future, people will often treat them differently than someone you think you will never see again."
This principle explains why trust can be built quickly when leaders demonstrate they're thinking beyond immediate transactions. By living and leading "in the shadow of the future," they create the psychological safety necessary for teams to suspend disbelief and embrace new possibilities.
Growing New Roots
Perhaps the most powerful metaphor Hruska offers is that of trees growing new roots.
“If you look at natural systems like fractals, like trees and other things, as they grow, they branch and form roots. And in my viewpoint, so does our life and so does reality.”
From Problems to Solutions
The final lesson from magic is perhaps the most practical: the importance of articulation over speed. "People are great at reporting problems, but we're not good at articulating the problem," Hruska explains. "If you can articulate a problem well enough, like all the edges of the problem, then the solution will form in the middle, like a donut."
This requires a fundamental shift in mindset. Instead of rushing to solve problems, magic makers invest time in understanding them completely. They recognize that problems are simply "something thrown in front of us"—obstacles between current reality and desired outcomes.
The magic isn't in the solution itself, but in the clarity that makes the solution inevitable.
Becoming a Magic Maker
The principles of magic offer a roadmap for anyone seeking to create positive change. By understanding the paradox of trusted deception, challenging reality metaphors, following the magic formula, thinking in shadows of the future, growing new roots, and articulating problems clearly, we can transform surprise into delight and impossibility into "not possible yet."
As Hruska puts it:
“There’s a difference between ‘possible’ and ‘impossible’ and ‘not possible yet.’ ”
The magic maker's mindset sees around the corner, into the branches of possibility that others haven't yet imagined.
In a world of constant change, perhaps it's time we all learned a little magic.
Editor’s note:
On an individual level, in Experiencing the Impossible: The Science of Magic, Gustav Kuhn explains that magic is the art of creating wonder by exploring the gaps in human perception and belief, causing us to experience cognitive conflict between what we know is possible and what we see.
People perceive magic as a pleasurable deception, willingly suspending disbelief to enjoy the sensation of the impossible. While the book doesn’t claim magic directly helps us cope with change, it shows that the way we process magical experiences—by adapting to surprises and resolving conflicts between belief and perception—mirrors how we handle uncertainty and adapt to unexpected changes in real life, highlighting our vulnerability to being deceived and mental flexibility to be open to the new.
Logan (2016) explores how the skills magicians use are surprisingly similar to what makes entrepreneurs successful in business. The study examines three main areas: first, it looks at what magicians do and the types of tricks they perform; second, it analyzes how entrepreneurial magicians develop their creative process when inventing new routines; and third, it studies how magicians communicate both verbally and non-verbally to connect with their audiences during performances.
The key finding is that while technical skill (like sleight of hand) is important for magicians, the real keys to success are creative thinking and effective communication - the same skills that make entrepreneurs successful in business. Just as a magician needs to innovate new tricks, develop compelling routines, and connect with audiences to have a successful show, entrepreneurs need to think creatively, develop their ideas, and communicate effectively with customers to build successful businesses.
On the organizational level, Lichtenstein (1997) studied how organizations transform by interviewing three experts who both theorize about and practice organizational change. The surprising finding was that while these experts use rational, logical theories to set up conditions for change, the actual breakthrough moments happened through what they described as "grace," "magic," and "miracles" - essentially spontaneous, unpredictable events.
Using chaos theory as a framework, the researchers identified a three-phase pattern: organizations start in a seemingly stable state with underlying tensions (dynamic order), reach a tipping point where rational approaches stop working (thresholds at the edge of logic), and then suddenly new solutions emerge on their own without being directly planned (self-organized emergence). The study aims to find a "chaotic logic" that explains how rational planning and intuitive breakthroughs work together in organizational transformation, suggesting that successful change requires both careful preparation and openness to unexpected developments.
Kuhn, G. (2019). Experiencing the impossible: The science of magic. Mit Press.
Lichtenstein, B. M. (1997). Grace, magic and miracles: A “chaotic logic” of organizational transformation. Journal of Organizational Change Management, 10(5), 393-411.
Logan, J. (2016). The Magic Behind Success: What Can Business Leaders Learn from Magicians Regarding Creativity and Communication?.
⭐ Mike’s MAGIC
Mike's magic is bringing people together to find shared dreams and helping them see possibilities that exist "around the corner" of their current reality. He transforms teams into "possibilitarians" who believe in what's "not possible yet" rather than accepting limitations. As he puts it, "my magic is bringing my team together, teams in my community together, teams inside of our clients together, and helping people find that ‘possibilitarianism’ and then move towards that change in the future."
Connect with Mike
Mike Hruska is a technologist who helped revolutionize learning through the Experience API, a designer who creates frameworks for organizational change, an entrepreneur who founded Problem Solutions to accelerate potential everywhere, and a recovered magician who spent four and a half years touring the country in a band. Guided by Ben Franklin's wisdom that "energy and persistence conquer all things," he leverages his experience as a former researcher at the National Institute of Standards and Technology to marry emerging technology with purpose. His company focuses on design and innovation for complex organizational challenges, believing that "if you articulate the problem well enough, the solution will appear in the middle of it," creating award-winning products and custom solutions across mobile, wearables, and desktop platforms.
Credits & Revisions:
Story Writer/Editor: Dr. Jiani Wu
AI Partner: Perplexity, Claude
Initial Publication: July 10 2025
Disclaimer:
AI technologies are harnessed to create initial content derived from genuine conversations. Human re-creation & review are used to ensure accuracy, relevance & quality.
